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 Bothrops insularis

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Albert J. Montejo
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Thu 12 May - 3:29

Hey Bushmaster, we are in the wrong genera , Dean is a good friend of mine we spoke not too long ago he needed some pers. comments from myself for a paper he's publishing for copeia on South American venomous reptiles Thanks and i read this article , if you like you may pm it to me when you have time ,

Best regards , looking forward to your comments Jaroslav , personal and observations with or with out reference's as when you are working with rare biota that has never been in captivity , it takes many years of personal observations before reference can be written.

Till then ,

Albert.
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Albert J. Montejo
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Thu 12 May - 17:23

April Mandell wrote : I've never seen Bothrops insularis either offered for sale, or in collections, public or private. Have any Venomland members kept, or seen, this species?

im the one who's befuddled , what does a taxonomic revision have to do with this question !

Regards .

Albert

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Guenter Leitenbauer
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Thu 12 May - 17:29

Mr Montejo,

I don't know if You are familiar to forums. But this happens when people talk or write - the original topic is enlarged, altered and other topics come up. No need to be "befuddled", I am sure this will do You no severe harm Wink

I - for my part - like this thread as it is and will continue to read the interesting statements. And we have good moderation here, which will us lead back to the main topic when we go to far away.
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Peter Zürcher
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Thu 12 May - 18:15

Quote :
what does a taxonomic revision have to do with this question !

It's been Mr Montejo himself referring to this Fenwick et al. revisional paper:

Quote :
Note my comments are in reference to the Fenwick PDF.

Using that paper as a reference before claiming it as offtopic.....well, ever heard of inconsequence?

The topic title is "Bothrops insularis"
Giving all available informations to this species should be a service from users to the community - that's how a discussion board works.
Some users may appreciate wide informations, some others don't. Its every one's free decision to read and use the informations given here - or to keep on scrolling Laughing

Have a nice day

Peter Zürcher

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Albert J. Montejo
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Thu 12 May - 22:58

a.) April, is clearly asking for any personal observations, not any taxonomic perspective.


b.) Peter wrote: I'm looking forward to hear more than (some observations) in captivity to underline your perspective.



i myself , i truly appreciate the Fenwick PDF as well i have no perspective yet on the Speckled forest-pitviper in captivity, as it's too soon for this rarely kept species, Bothriopsis taeniata , just a lowly pers. observation and thats all.

By presenting the Fenwick PDF, Guenter is correct the thread was expanded , yet in content Bothriopsis taeniata was cited in the context of the PDF and so opened the way for comments.

i believe i was wrongly called out , but dont really care just a notation, after all im the one with the most personal observations.

Thanks and regards Albert.


Addtl. im looking forward to Peters and Guenters Pers. observation on Bothrops insularis to anwsers Aprils question. im sure she could locate this PDF herself or perhaps has already read it.

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Guenter Leitenbauer
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Thu 12 May - 23:25

Albert J. Montejo wrote:
Addtl. im looking forward to Peters and Guenters Pers. observation on Bothrops insularis to anwsers Aprils question. im sure she could locate this PDF herself or perhaps has already read it.


Don't behave that ... well, I won't write that now, Mr Montejo.
I do not know what terrific scientific reputation You have in herpetology, but I clearly have none and therefor I cannot add something useful to the original question of this thread.
But if You believe that this is a forum where only You and people, that have a reputation exceeding Yours should be allowed to write their opinion, I guess You are wrong.
From all I read in the last couple of weeks, the impression that You feel the necessity to comment each and every thread, crawls into my mind. I am no psychiatrist, so the reasons for that are beyond my understanding.
Regards
Guenter
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Marthinus C. Harmse
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Thu 12 May - 23:57

Mr. Montejo

You do seem knowledgable.
Despite this I can not help but to agree with Guenter or Peter.
Forums require a certain style and you do not adhere to either correct writing or etiquette (Im guilty of this too at times).

Lets carry on in a standardised way so we can enjoy the forum.
We are looking forward to obtaining new perspectives on discussions in which you are involved in.

Regards.
MCH
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Peter Zürcher
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Fri 13 May - 0:15

Quote :
Peter wrote: I'm looking forward to hear more than (some observations) in captivity to underline your perspective.

Yes, exactly, Mr. Montejo, and please keep that in context, you introduced your taxonomic perspective here (before claiming now to have none):

Quote :
i find from observations in captivity of this specimen Bothriopsis taenieata to be consistent to Lachesis species

and you've been speaking about taeniata as an "arboreal Bushmaster".
I'm not into South American Crotalids, but interested in taxonomic and systematic relevance of these species. Trying to learn from an expert, i asked you for other and more serious arguments supporting your view - meanwhile I've been coming to the conclusion that you don't have any.

You might have done lots of observations in South American Crotalids, but you don't have the ability to pass it down to others in a conceptional way.
Additionally you have an addiction to expose yourself with doubtful pretences, and if one's trying to sound you out nothing more than talking round the subject's coming up.
Sincerely
Peter Zürcher

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April Mandel
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Fri 13 May - 3:02

When I opened this thread, it was for the purpose of gaining increased awareness concerning a species I've never seen. Any information offered by the membership is welcomed, and it would be self-defeating to solicit responses limited only to the questions or observations offered by myself.

Any thread posted in an open forum has the potential to take on a life of its own, and the more directions taken only improves the value of the thread. I'd prefer the central theme to remain B. insularis; if the specific subject of discussion is centered on taxonomic perspectives or captive breeding, or whatever, I have no interest in stifling the free exchange of ideas.
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Albert J. Montejo
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Fri 13 May - 3:45

i am nothing more than a product of my enviroment, i have allowed my self the to absorb what has been taught to me in a social enviroment in a show and tell manner or hands on approach by the worlds best professional technicians .

Basically an informed trapper/collector - importer/ exporter and when the need arrives a breeder,

My function and contribution to herpetology has been to locate the worlds rarest specimens and supply them to you , there by filling the void .

Nothing more and nothing less , the bottom line is the specimen in your lab. and all this paper work together would not even be a down payment on a Oxyuranus specie of any type.

i am sorry that in certain parts of the world you do not have access to new world species and have to conform your self with what you can get , truly sorry.

* most important note, thank you for allowing an example of free speech on this board please remember we are setting an example to some fellow herpetoculturist that have never experienced free speech in their lifetime.

Oh and Marthinus, never look a gift horse in the mouth , imagine if i wouldnt like the way indigenious people communicated in an indigenious launguage to me about and how we were going to find certain species of reptiles so in closing ....Welcome To The Jungle!!

Cheers Albert.


* My clients love it when you say this has been impossible , my friends also smile thanks for the compliment Peter, be free .
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Peter Zürcher
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Fri 13 May - 4:02

Thank you for that enlightening statement, Mr. Montejo.
No further questions....

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Guenter Leitenbauer
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Fri 13 May - 15:01

Peter Zürcher wrote:
Thank you for that enlightening statement, Mr. Montejo.
No further questions....

Exactly my thoughts!
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Walter Silva
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Tue 17 May - 13:47

Hi my friends:

In my visit to Brasil, I view the B insularis, and it´s a wonderful snake..very nice color.

Sorry for the bad pics...

Greetings from Incas´Land

[img][/img]

[img][/img]

[img][/img]
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Peter Zürcher
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Tue 17 May - 18:05

Very interesting.
Thank you for sharing these pictures, Walter!

Peter

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Marthinus C. Harmse
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Tue 17 May - 18:08

wow.
Thanks Walter for your contribution.
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Bostjan Kraner
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Tue 17 May - 18:40

Thanx for sharing. Nice snake.

Best regards, BKK
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Albert J. Montejo
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Tue 17 May - 21:22

Walter , excellent personal observation , as they say "one picture say's a thousand words" !.

Regards,

Albert.
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April Mandel
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Wed 18 May - 2:12

They're WONDERFUL photos Walter, THANK YOU!!!

These are the best pictures of Bothrops insularis that I've ever seen!
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Albert J. Montejo
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Wed 18 May - 2:21

They are excellent , aren't they April, those boxes may be 50 yrs old antiques (semi) English standards.

Seems to be at Instituto Butantan, Sao Paulo. April the photo is priceless ive got some stuck in my old imac eventually ill recover them and find a host site that works without a password so we can get this party started .

Till then fair maiden ,

Al.
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Paul Hermann
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PostSubject: Re: Bothrops insularis   Fri 12 Feb - 23:01

Thank you Walter for those great pics, we don't get to see pictures of a B. insularis often. This subspecies looks interesting but very fragile at the same time. I hope it isn't genetically dead, so to speak, due to the isolation of its population on the Queimada Grande island.
Like most of you I assume, I would like to set foot on this island one day and to see those animals but things aren't that simple.
Regards, P
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